> -----Original Message----- > From: Scott Schultz [mailto:scott at cjhunter.com] > > The way I see it, Vlad and Timmer/whoever came to an "understanding". That > "understanding" was reached based upon a trading of favors. Vlad had no > incentive to stick his neck out any further than he already had unless > Timmer/whoever gave him what he wanted. At point, he owed that person a > debt. The incentive then was the discharging of the debt, which > Timmer/whoever then made possible. The definition of "work", to me, is the > creation and discharge of this debt between the two people. The justice of > the thing is just icing on the cake. > > Let's look at it this way. Suppose Vlad was still in the Jhereg. The Demon > comes to him and says "I have a problem that I need handled with utmost > discretion. The person who handles this problem for me can expect to have > his territory doubled in size." Vlad says "My territory is big enough for > me, but I have a friend who is interested in expanding. I'll let him know > about the opportunity." He then carries out the hit and is rewarded with a > larger territory. No cash changes hands. Is this "work"? > > Let's change the scenario slightly. The Demon visits Vlad and says "I'm > impressed with your operation. I'm recommending that the Council make you > a > baron (he's originally a baronet)and double your territory." Vlad is > flattered and proud. The Demon makes good on his word and Vlad is made a > baron. A week later, the Demon drops by unexpectedly and asks "Do you like > your new digs? All happy and cozy?" When Vlad replies in the affirmative, > The Demon then says "BTW, I have this little problem and I was hoping > you'd > know someone who could help me with it." Vlad accepts the contract and > performs the hit gratis as repayment for the promotion arranged by The > Demon. Is this "work"? Both of these boil down to the same thing. In the first instance, I would say yes, and in the second I would say no. The primary difference between them being that in the second the Demon flat out states that he's exerting his influence in the council (which is a relatively unique trait) to help out Vlad, who is in a relatively unique position to help out the Demon (considering his credentials). The first however could be a case of the Demon simply giving some of his own territory (or acquiring territory from someone else) to Vlad, which makes it analogous to currency, and any Jhereg with some territory to spare could make a payment of this kind. So without a little more detail these two scenarios are being examined on the basis of two or three words. The fact that the course of events is reversed in the two scenarios is mostly immaterial. > > Maybe we should remove financial gaine from the picture entirely. Morollan > finds himself being blackmailed over some minor but embarassing thing. > Vlad > visits The Demon and asks him to call off the blackmail. The Demon, an > obliging fellow, says "Seeing as it's the Lord Morrolan and that blackmail > was unauthorized, I'll write the blackmailer a note telling him to knock > it > off. As it turns out, this fellow has caused us a bit of embarassment by > blackmailing several Lords and possibly even embezzling from The > Organization. Maybe you could deliver a letter to him? He'll be at > location > X at time Y tomorrow evening for a meeting." Vlad ices the guy. Is this > "work"? No. Only the Demon (or similar high ranking Jhereg) could have provided that assistance (in the form of implying that it's okay for Vlad to off the teckla), so we have again a situation where two people are pretty uniquely suited to helping each other. That's not to say that Vlad couldn't have just offed the guy anyway, but this would have been riskier without that agreement. That's also not to say that it's a morally agreeable solution to the problem, however effective it might be. > > Is it the money changing hands that makes it "work" or is it the intention > of the two parties that makes it "work"? Is it the justice of a "deserved" > death over an "undeserved" death that makes it "work" or not? IMO it's the currency changing hands. And when I say currency, I mean anything that can be considered directly analogous to cash. Territory can be called cash. Knowing that the Demon says you're clear to take out this guy is not cash, and can't be called analogous to it. It's something that only a council member can provide, which makes it a pretty unique consideration. A favor; not some middle manager with a grudge and a big purse, those are a dime a dozen. If there's no currency, then the principals are just exchanging favors, providing a benefit to each other that they each can spare.