FelixEisen at aol.com writes: -snip- > gobs of spoilers, so here's your spoiler space. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 17 traditional Great Weapons, a whole host of Morganti blades. It > is clear (from commentary -- Kragar's?) that the Morganti weapon was > the Serioli plan for the elimination of war, and maybe murder, too > -- make the idea of killing someone so repugnant ('cause you're > destroying their 'immortal soul') that the entire concept of > war/murder becomes anathemic to your society. -snip- That's what Kragar said [1]. Vlad thought the idea and maybe also that it worked was crazy, but Kragar pointed out that it worked *among the Serioli*. As you also point out, it isn't clear if the Serioli were trying to stop war among themselves, stop themselves from fighting Dragaerans/Easterners, or stop war between any of those three races. (Yeah, that was not a parallel grammatical construction. Deal.) [1] Quick reminder, I think Kragar's probably telling the truth, but: + Kragar's source might have been wrong. + Kragar might have misunderstood/misremembered his source. + Kragar might have been lying to Vlad. + Vlad might have misunderstood/misremembered Kragar. + Vlad might have lied to the -"shiny metal box with presumed-ears-at-both-ends". + The translater/transcriber might have screwed up. > The Great Weapons don't exist, just 'regular' Morganti blades. > Considering the timeline: I'd give a 95% chance this happened BEFORE > the arrival of humans (Easterners) on Dragaera; if it'd happened > before that, I think you mean after... > then the Serioli would have been willing to accept the existence of > the human colonists amongst them. (Besides, humans are clearly > widespread, while Dragaerans are, for the most part, centrally > located. More on this in a bit.) ...and I don't think it necessarily follows. Serioli are not necessarily monolothic, and anyway we don't understand how they think. Maybe the appearance of new races would have been enough to make them reconsider their stance on war. Furthermore, it appears to me that Morganti blades require magic and thus cannot be made until after the Big Bang that made the Greater Sea of Chaos, which post-dates the appearance of Easterners, Jenoine, and Dragaerans. > It is possible, however, that it happened shortly -after- the > arrival of the colony, but only if the Serioli are functionally > immune to Morganti blades, as follows: war began between colonists > and Serioli, and the weapons which the Serioli forged -- for -all- > 'sharp artifacts of steel' made by the Serioli are Morganti, -snip- Why would all Serioli-forged blades automatically be Morganti? Issola names the Serioli smith who invented Morganti blades [1]. Plus, doesn't it seem likely that it was war waged with metallic blades that was the motivating factor to stop war? (I don't remember if Morganti blades must be steel/iron-based. Note that Spellbreaker did not appear to be iron-based.) [1] I don't think it can convincingly be argued that Sethra meant Morganti blades had already been invented and that that smith invented (the advances that led to) *Great Weapons*. > Then the Jenoine show up. Immensely powerful, they form their own > enclave, with which to experiment on the 'surrounding critters'. In > this case, the primary 'surrounding critter' was the human; clearly > sentient, they were a perfect subject for experimentation. The > Serioli, having long since reached their 'no more war' policy, maybe > send in a few protests, but they're not at the same power level as > the Jenoine, so the Jenoine tell 'em to bite it before returning to > their experiments. The Serioli shrug, and wander off. Humans > aren't -that- high on their important list, and it's not like the > Jenoine are destroying their souls, right? Tangent: I wonder how intrusive the Jenoine presence generally was, especially given their odd (non-)view of location. Generally, did most Easterners even know the Jenoine existed, and if so, did they recognize them as a threat? Ditto the Dragaerans, if their numbers got large prior to the big kaboom. > Then we have a big kaboom, a Great Sea of Chaos, a few gods, > etc. etc. These aforementioned Gods have two primary motives: > survival and freedom. For the moment they have freedom, and their > enemies are (ahem) in chaos; the Gods turn to individuals they > -know- will be their allies -- the 'new humans', i.e. Dragaerans, > and the old humans, who undoubtedly dislike the Jenoine because, > well, would YOU want aliens coming by to abduct and experiment on > your sister? ... if you live in a remote area that has experienced > abductions, PLEASE don't answer that one. The Primary assistance > comes from the experiments (i.e. Dragaerans) who, having been direct > victims, of course team up. -snip- The few (?) Easterners and Dragaerans knowledgable about the Jenoine threat would be allies, but it's not clear the "general masses" would be particularly worried about the Jenoine or motivated to do anything about them. - tky