At 07:13 PM 8/14/2002 -0700, Nytemuse wrote: >I think the business community is winning on that one... I think you're right. > but who >cares. Language is subjective, like all things. Oh, how splendid! An argument! <rubs hands together with glee> "Language is subjective, like all things." Well, in the first place, we're simply going to have to disagree about all things being subjective. In fact, I believe that there is an objective reality, and that we will never understand it fully does not relieve us of the responsibility to try. But let us pass on to language. Can it simply be dismissed as "subjective?" I'm not sure. My inclination is to say no. Language has at least two important uses--first, it is how we think, second, it is how we communicate our thoughts. Let us consider the second. The easiest two examples to illustrate my point would be mathematics and music. Let us consider mathematics. It is obviously a language--that is, a coherent system of symbols. Is there any objective truth to the proposition that 2+3=5? Well, sure, at least insofar as if I pile up two books, add another three to the pile, I will have five books in the pile. Now, two individuals can agree that, amongst themselves, they will use the symbol "4" to represent three. Among the two of them, that would work, so I guess in that sense language could be considered subjective. But if they want to communicate with the rest of the world, they really ought to agree about what symbols mean what. Obviously, if I write down some sheet music that an F# occurs here for four bars, and one of the musicians decides that, for his purposes, "F#" means the chord that rest of us call "C" and that "four bars" means "six bars" the music will not come out the way I had intended it. It seems to me that language, while often subjective, has an objective element insofar as it is shared. As for English, well, consider that you and I pretty much agree, at least in general, on what "subjective" means, and that, if we didn't, we'd be unable to have this delightful discussion. While it is clear that not all words in English have exact, precise meanings in which all nuances are completely understood and agreed upon by everyone, there are two things I believe-- 1) The more any given group agrees on the meaning of a word, the better they are able to exchange ideas. 2) The more we have words available that make clear, nice distinctions, the more precisely, elegantly, and, ultimately, creatively we are able to think. Okay, we're off. *Now* we're having fun. <grin>